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Handprint In Dust. Changes After Pictures Started Being Taken


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#1 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 10:47 AM

I have posted on this site before due to waking up and seeing a shadow person walk past my bed..I have exhaustively searched and talked to groups. Had two groups in my home that verified activity so it was not nite terrors or sleep paralysis. This past sat nite, 1-12-08 we took photos and photographed a mist, an orb(at the top of the lampshade), but the handprint is the most interesting. We tried to duplicate it as you can see in one of the photos. A human hand is concave in the middle and this is flat at the palm and started with four finger prints but on the third and subsequent photos there are five. The fifth just appeared as we were in the process of taking the photos. Three of us have seen small or bent over things running past this spot on two occasions. Also that nite the light or chandalier above my dining room table was swinging. We tried to duplicate that by seeing if it was a heat vent but could not duplicate it. Also in the closet where the orb is three people saw a box on the floor move and clothes moving on the hangar. One tried to lay on my bed...he was a skeptic before that nite. He made it 2 or 3 minutes and came running our of my bedroom with fear in his eyes and said something was moving things around in the same closet. There are lots more...but I really want an opinion from people who know more than me about the hand? print. I am also a former skeptic! No longer as it or they are in my house and I can not sleep until I am so tired I just go to sleep from exhaustion... With the tv and a light on....ok so I am a big wuss! But you live here!  Thanks!

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Edited by imaginthat, 22 January 2008 - 12:11 PM.


#2 Aslan

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 11:19 AM

i believe you

however those pictures in the dust are not proving anything to me
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#3 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 11:42 AM

QUOTE(Aslan @ Jan 14 2008, 01:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
i believe you

however those pictures in the dust are not proving anything to me

Thanks for your reply. Maybe I should have stated what I am looking for better. I would rather disprove them. I have had too many experts here that said my home is highly active and with at least one negative or non human. However the fifth finger print appeared after we started taking the photos. I have tried to disprove it and I cannot make the same print. Our hands are concave in the palm and this is clearly flat and and the overall print is small. Looks more like a bear print than a human. Length is app. 5 3/4 in. and approximately 3" at the widest. The other handprint next to it was our first attempt to duplicate it. The person who did that has small hands and you can see it is clearly larger. So if it can not be disproved then the question becomes ... has anyone seen anything like this or can anyone provide some further explanation. The other pictures are just for viewing and probably could be explained better than the print. Thanks again.

#4 Vlawde

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 11:47 AM

I would think it possible that the print could be made by putting the meat of one's palm down, curving the fingers and just touching the tips down.

  Have you considered it might be a footprint? It almost looks like someone with bare feet was stepping there with the front part of their foot without touching their heels down. With the separation, it looks like toe prints to me
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#5 Aslan

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 11:50 AM

see that is the problem

i cant prove anything from those pictures - they are just marks in the dust

ask the spirit to spell out a word or something or draw a picture

on the opposite side i cant disprove them either - you say that they just 'magically' appeared (i am harsh but never cruel) - i believe you - but i need to see video of them just appearing to try and disprove them

if you get my meaning - its too easy for me to say that you made those marks took a picture then fabricated a story to follow
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Posted 14 January 2008 - 12:04 PM

del

Edited by ellsbeth, 17 January 2008 - 09:30 PM.


#7 borntolive

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 12:26 PM

Hi there, did you ever think about setting up a video camera in your house and let it run?
Maybe you can get more from that.

I saw the pictures and don't really see anything in the closet other then reflexion from the
clothing frame.
But the hand prints could have been made by humans (to help you with that
I leave prints like that because I can't completely straighten my fingers due to rheumatism)
maybe someone just forgot they put his/her hand there?
I'm not saying I don't believe you but am trying to think logically.




Dreams happen to us.
        We do not dream.
                We are dreamt ~ Carl Jung.


Love lookes not with the eyes, but with the heart ~ W. Shakespear

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 12:43 PM

Yes, as you are a casual poster. I would do all the suggestions above.

#9 Snowlord

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 01:15 PM

The first thing to consider is that you can't really prove, or disprove, anything with a photograph. That is just a waste of time. Pictures are only good for bringing up possibilities or starting discussions or investigations, they can never be proof. They are just too easy to fake, or mess up unintentionally, or many other things that render them unreliable as direct evidence.

As for the pictures you have posted ... I see marks that might, or might not be hand prints, and some flash reflection anomalies. Could be something, but its more likely its not. No way to tell from a picture.

#10 Arithorne

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 01:34 PM

Not sure about the dust, but the last two images, specificly the last, you can clearly see its a reflection cast by the metal shelf (overhang) from the camera flash.

if in doubt take a series of pictures there, and if it turns out in each and every pic, then you know its man made, or a reflection in this case.

#11 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 02:33 PM

QUOTE(Vlawde @ Jan 14 2008, 01:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I would think it possible that the print could be made by putting the meat of one's palm down, curving the fingers and just touching the tips down.

  Have you considered it might be a footprint? It almost looks like someone with bare feet was stepping there with the front part of their foot without touching their heels down. With the separation, it looks like toe prints to me

Thanks for your response. I did think about that. If you look at one picture it shows a regular handprint. Problem is we could not make a handprint without the obvious concave from the palm showing. We did consider a footprint however I live by myself and no one else could be here to make it especially that small a foot. It looks like a bear print more than anything. The odd thing is we never left the area and took all the pictures within a few minutes of each other. How did it go from four to five digits while we were there taking pictures?

#12 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 02:42 PM

QUOTE(Aslan @ Jan 14 2008, 01:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
see that is the problem

i cant prove anything from those pictures - they are just marks in the dust

ask the spirit to spell out a word or something or draw a picture

on the opposite side i cant disprove them either - you say that they just 'magically' appeared (i am harsh but never cruel) - i believe you - but i need to see video of them just appearing to try and disprove them

if you get my meaning - its too easy for me to say that you made those marks took a picture then fabricated a story to follow

I understand they are just marks in the dust but I never said they just "magically appeared".  I said somehow after the second photo it went from 4 to 5 digits/fingers or whatever. I have had professional ghost hunters and empaths/mediums investigating and they all seen the shadows of figures, smelled the perfume and ozone, heard the noises, etc. It is not just me...everyone that has ever come to this house has experiences and it has changed two hard skeptics into believers. The handprint is just very strange. You can try to duplicate it if you like but we could not make a handprint look like that. And I do not take you as harsh or cruel just skeptical as you should be and as I am. By the way I spent ten years in the Submarine Service, skydived, and many other things. I am not easily intimidated or scared but this thing is different. By the way I have went through bed shaking, being grabbed on the ankle, being touched on the leg, had bottles, etc. fly off countertops but it was only after I saw that shadow person that I got spooked.

#13 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 02:58 PM

QUOTE(ellsbeth @ Jan 14 2008, 02:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I dunno, I would probably try cleansing this area with some sage smudge, white candles, blessings, incense.If this does not work and you are this afraid, please check with a local paranormal group/experts for help.And the negative energy from your fear possibly makes these things worse, IMHO.Hope this helps,Ell
Hi Ell,I have had a professional paranormal group here along with an empath. The empath said there are three or four here and one particularly here she did not like as it was "smarter than us and knew it".  They did an investigation and saw/heard/smelled everything I have been going through. The empath did a ritual cleansing of my bedroom with a sage smudge, candles, blessings and incense as you suggested and it did not seem to help. I had another empath here and she said the same as the first. There are four here and one is dominate and probably not human. It is keeping the others from doing much or communicating much. I am working on getting a whole house cleansing from someone who knows what they are doing as I do not and do not want to venture into things I know nothing about. I am a former diehard skeptic but no longer. I still believe a lot of what I see on tv is for tv but I have also had two other die hard skeptics leave my house believing after spending the evening here. One left scared silly after being bold and trying to lay in my bedroom for a few minutes they came running out scared to death and said something was moving things around. I understand I am not a professional and probably a lot will not believe me about this but I will say this...EVERYONE who has spent two hours in my house including professional paranormal groups believe it is highly active and have even said I do not know how you sleep in your bedroom...their words! So I am not inventing this! Thanks for your response. I say to everyone...go try to duplicate the print! Can not do it and I did not make it. Thanks
QUOTE(Arithorne @ Jan 14 2008, 03:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not sure about the dust, but the last two images, specificly the last, you can clearly see its a reflection cast by the metal shelf (overhang) from the camera flash.if in doubt take a series of pictures there, and if it turns out in each and every pic, then you know its man made, or a reflection in this case.
Hi Arithorne,Thanks for your response. I agree the one thing can be a reflection. In fact like I said in my original post I can easily explain away everything but the handprint. The one thing about the reflection is it changes direction but I still am not that excited about it or the mist. The handprint or what ever it is has everyone here trying to figure it out. It clearly went from four to five digits while we were taking the pictures and we have tried to duplicate it but can not. Human handprints are obviously human looking. This looks more like a bear print??? I live here by myself and I can guarantee you I did not make it...I have no cats or anything that could have gotten up there. I am just looking to see if anyone else has ever seen anything like it as there are people here that have much more experience than I do. Thanks for your feedback.

#14 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 03:13 PM

QUOTE(Snowlord @ Jan 14 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The first thing to consider is that you can't really prove, or disprove, anything with a photograph. That is just a waste of time. Pictures are only good for bringing up possibilities or starting discussions or investigations, they can never be proof. They are just too easy to fake, or mess up unintentionally, or many other things that render them unreliable as direct evidence.

As for the pictures you have posted ... I see marks that might, or might not be hand prints, and some flash reflection anomalies. Could be something, but its more likely its not. No way to tell from a picture.

Hi Snowlord,
Thanks for your response. I am not submitting these as proof or suggesting they are proof. I am asking for help from people who know more than I do about this stuff. They are not fake and I live by myself and I know I did not do them. There were five witnesses here when the photos were taken and no one touched them yet it went from four to five digits? So I am just asking for help as to what might they be not trying to offer them as proof. I know they are real and the people who were here know they are real I would just like to know if anyone else has ever seen anything like it and what it might be. I assure you I am too busy to make things up and I am far to skeptical to invite attention to this. I am living with it. I can not sleep and I am having problems even living in my own home. I have had a professional paranormal group here and two empaths. They all concur this is a very active home and both empaths came to essentially the same conclusion that there are at least three things here and probably a fourth. One of them is non human and is stronger or dominate over the others. It is not just me it is also the professionals that have experienced these things. Again thanks for your reply. Sorry if I sound a little tense...but it seems all I am getting is people who think I am making this up or somehow made this handprint or whatever it is. I am asking for someone serious that will not offer suggestions as to how it could be faked or a footprint or whatever. I do not care about evidence. I care about getting this out of my house so I can feel safe again. Thanks for your reply and maybe someone will understand the photo is a representation of all the other things that are going on and maybe the photo might help identify what that is....Then I can get rid of it and get some rest....and not feel threatened in my home. By the way...I am tense from what is going on so everyone please understand I am not upset with those who respond and appreciate all the advice smile.gif Thanks to you all. I assure you this is real!

#15 Ridinghood

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 03:53 PM

do you possibly have a video recorder to record such incidents? or possibly a audio recorder to record evp?

Edited by Ridinghood, 14 January 2008 - 03:55 PM.


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Posted 14 January 2008 - 04:06 PM

del

Edited by ellsbeth, 17 January 2008 - 09:31 PM.


#17 Snowlord

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 05:44 PM

Do not worry, imaginthat ... I will "fake" the handprint picture for you, if that will give you some peace. I just need to find the right patch of dust. I will be back.

#18 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 07:34 PM

QUOTE(Snowlord @ Jan 14 2008, 07:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Do not worry, imaginthat ... I will "fake" the handprint picture for you, if that will give you some peace. I just need to find the right patch of dust. I will be back.

OK with me. We tried and could not do it. Also you might tell me how it went from four to five between the second and third photo. I am up for any explanation for sure. Also maybe we could explain the bottles flying off the countertops at me, the perfume smell, the ozone smell, waking up with scratches on my shoulder and chest and the burning that goes with that, the dark shadow figure that walked right past me while I was in bed, other shadow figures, things being moved around, tugging on the back of my chair, waking me up in the middle of the nite banging and moving, grabbing my ankle while I was in bed, sitting on my bed, laying on my bed...yes I felt it distinctly... and everything else that is going on here that has been witnessed by professional paranormal groups and empaths. You might help me with why every skeptic that has come into my home for at least two hours has been scared to death by what is going on. Perhaps the handprint can be explained but I did not put it there and it changed from four to five prints between the second and third photo. I am not kidding and I am not lying and I am not making this up! I wrote this and sent the pictures hoping someone else had seen something like it. Not to have people tell me I am making it up or someone else did it. I am the biggest skeptic , or was, but I have lived this for five years since moving into this home and it is getting worse and I am tired and I am tired of this and it needs to go away. I thought someone here might help recognize what made that to help understand how to get rid of it but for the most part I am getting the feeling that most want to believe I am making it up. I live by myself. No one else did it. It did change from four to five as we were taking pictures and no one did that for sure. I am a former pilot, submarine officer, and worked in the aerospace industry as operations manager for years, etc. I have no desire to make it up or fake anything, it is not in my DNA to do something like that. In fact I would just as soon this be a distant memory! Every professional paranormal and empath that has been here has said the same thing... I do not know how you sleep in that home! The answer is I do not. I finally fall asleep around four or five in the morning from exhaustion and even then like this morning at 5:30 after a whole 1 1/2 hours of sleep something startled me wide awake. Can you tell I am not in the mood for anyone telling me it is faked? Sorry but lack of sleep, tired of all this, and not being taken seriously has me a little stressed out. Nothing personal but you have to understand it is not just me but a whole range of people have experienced this it is just me that has to keep coming home and coping with it and trying to sleep with it. So please do not take it personal...sometimes it is good to accept something and someone as honest and truthful and not look for deception because this is not.

#19 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 07:43 PM

QUOTE(ellsbeth @ Jan 14 2008, 06:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If you have had 2 empaths and the investigation team in,  they should have done a thorough cleansing.
I would either request that they do a better investigation/cleansing, or find a different team.
Perhaps you need a larger group with a lot of experience with cleansing rituals.
Even if you have to contact a local Pagan/Wiccan/Religious group with this type of experience.
The problem is that sometimes it takes a "larger" more focused group who will use a pure energy.
And it may take several attempts.

I personally would try a well-established Pagan/Wiccan group, or Native American group as they are used to this kind of thing.
Chantie,

Ell

Hi Ell,
Thanks for writing. Actually one was an empath and a wiccan. She is the one that stopped and said I do not like this. It is smarter than us and it knows it. She did a cleansing of my bedroom with sage smudging and did some ritual in it then did something with sea salt and rose quartz. She said that should protect me from the non human one. That seemed to work for one day but that was it. I think it just slowed it down smile.gif I have someone else that was here last Sat nite that is coming over again this sat nite and she is able to communicate. She has communicated with three but the three said there is a fourth that is non human and is dominate over them so they do not want to communicate much with her. So both have empaths? have said essentially the same thing. They both also said that it does want to do me harm...already scratched me pretty bad and had bottles thrown at me. As you can see it is not very comfortable in this house...especially as I live here by myself. If this does not work I am thinking of biting the bullet and talking to a priest. Hate to say it but it has gotten that bad. I am only getting two hours of sleep or so at nite because it seems every time I try to go to sleep things start banging around and it gets active here and that keeps me awake especially because I am afraid I will see that shadow man again and I am convince he is the bad one. He was only 18 inches from me and I was trapped. Thank god he just walked on out of the house. But I got the worst feeling from that! Thanks again. I will keep you posted.

#20 imaginthat

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Posted 14 January 2008 - 07:52 PM

QUOTE(Ridinghood @ Jan 14 2008, 05:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
do you possibly have a video recorder to record such incidents? or possibly a audio recorder to record evp?

Hi and thanks for writing. The paranormal group got one evp that was not intelligible. They had several emf hits especially around my bed. They seen several shadow people and heard with their ears a womans voice. Several knocks in the walls they said was clearly paranormal and other things including smelling perfume and ozone. They were more than a little fearful of my closet and did not really want to go back in there alone. The empath was a Wiccan and she said there were 3 or 4 here and one she did not like. She said it was smarter than us and knew it and was playing with us. She also said it was non human or very angry and did want to harm me. I guess that is why I wake up with scratches that burn and the bottles that fly off the counter into my lap. I am at the point where I am going to go all out to get rid of this. I am tired of not sleeping and tired of not feeling welcome or comfortable in my own home!  I got the same the next Sat nite from a sensitive. She told me the exact same thing the empath told me the prior sat nite. I was just curious about the hand? Print as I will guarantee you that it changed from four to five fingertip prints as we were taking the picture. Anyway I appreciate your writing and will update..just hope someone can tell me if they have seen anything like that print before. Thanks