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Clutter Vs. Paranormal


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#1 Amethyst

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 06:27 AM

I was recently asked to do a walk through in a house where they were experiencing some activity.  The only thing that I agreed with is that I felt the presence of a man that I thought could be buried on the property.  Their son has claimed to see a man dressed in black walking along the property line, which I think they are on several acres with woods in the back.  I think the child is  somewhat sensitive.

My biggest problem was when I walked into the house I was overwhelmed with clutter.  They had at least 4-5 boxes stacked on the kitchen table.  I couldn't tell you what color the counter top was because there was so much stuff!  I mean piles of junk everywhere, it was a very large room.

If those kids had one toy they had 1,000, and I'm not kidding.  I have never seen so many toys in my life.  I went into their room and I promise you, their bed, a full size one they share, had so many toys and stuffed animals on it there was only room for the kid to lay flat on his back.  There would be no way they could move around.  Stuff was scattered all over the place.  The entire house was like one giant pile of junk and clutter.

That mess and clutter made me feel so uneasy I couldn't stand it.  I just wanted to start picking stuff up and cleaning their entire house.  I would get a dumpster and just start shoveling crud out the door.  Now it wasn't filthy or anything, it was just stuff.

The only room they felt comfortable in was the living room, and it wasn't too junked up.  At least you could sit on the couch and see the floor.

They were describing to me how they would feel anxious and uncomfortable.  I so wanted to say, look, it's nothing paranormal here except for what's outside, it's this darn clutter.  I couldn't wait to get out of there.

The kid doesn't want to sleep in his room.  Hell, I wouldn't either!  It was dark and dank and there was so much stuff in there I would go insane if I had to sleep in there. Also if a kid says I'm scared then they get to sleep with mom and dad, plus there is competition with a baby brother.  I didn't think he was "scared" in there, I think he wanted attention....JMHO

So I told them, you know, objects hold energy and you have so many things in his room that he may be feeling overwhelmed.  You need to completely clean out his room and get all that stuff out of there and move his furniture around.

They promised they would completely clean out his room.  I told them to keep things at a bare minimum in there.  Heck, just being able to roll over and stretch out in bed would be nice. I felt kind of bad, but I swear I think the kid was suffering from all that stuff piled up in his bed and room.  We will be doing a follow up so I will be curious to see how this kid reacts to having his room clean.

I know as a sensitive I can't stand for things to be messy and thrown about.  I may be OC, but I have to have things orderly and tidy.  I have never seen a house with so much junk in it.  It was a cute little house, but good lord it was messy.

IMHO, I think part of their uneasy feeling is all that junk piled up.  I do think there is some mild activity in the house occasionally, but they claim to feel uneasy all the time except in the living room.  It's the mess, but how do you say that to somebody without insulting them or hurting their feelings?  I am brutally honest, and I did muster up the courage to tell them to clean that kid's room up top to bottom.  Maybe if they do that they will notice the difference in the energy of the room and decide to clean the rest of it.

I do think that families imprint rooms.  Have you ever walked into a room where somebody has been fighting or crying?  You can feel that energy in the room.  I cannot imagine living in that clutter day in and day out.  

I think clutter can influence people to feel uneasy and the sense of being watched with umpteen stuffed animals with lifeless eyes staring at you every day.  It was just a creepy feeling and not a paranormal one.

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#2 Vlawde

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 06:36 AM

We've been to a few houses where the clutter...AND in a few cases filth were overwhelming. Walls covered in dirty handprints, crayons and other stuff I didn't want to know about. Rooms FULL of dirty laundry, stacks of books and clutter where you had a skinny path to walk through the house. In several cases we determined any paranormal activity was due to the imagination of someone on methamphetamines. We try to pre screen these beforehand, but still get surprised every now and then.

  I'm not a clean freak, and have my share of clutter, but jeez....when it is gross and gets in the way of normal household activitys...
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#3 Tantric KittenGStudy

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 07:35 AM

Get used to the garbage houses.  You get one or two a year.  They are absolutely overwhelming and it's hard to focus on what's going on, you're right.  At least it was just cluttered and reasonably hygenic.  We all brought home fleas once.  We also refuse to return (they are a "feed the beast" sort of client... so they picked up someone new).
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#4 Mia Camille

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 07:47 AM

i'm not a clean freak but i mean there is a minimum in the housework that has to be done, i HATE cleaning but hey I can't stand a dirty house

#5 shonalynn

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 08:06 AM

Okay...being as how I have OCD when it comes to dirt and cleaning, just reading this thread made me feel uneasy!!
I am sure the clutter had a lot to do with it. Like you said...no wonder they didn't want to sleep in their own room. I wouldn't either. I don't take Fung Shui to seriously, but I do think there is something to it. Think of all the energy that is left packed into that house because it can't escape! I agree...have them clean all that clutter out first, THEN see what kind of activity and vibes they get. I bet they will be pleasantly suprised.  Now I must go clean again after reading this!  rolleyes.gif
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#6 Ectoplazzum

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 10:52 AM

Depending on the magnitude of the alleged paranormal activity, do you think that maybe the condition of the house might be directly related in some cases?  What if it's a case of what is happening is much more serious?   Depending upon what type of spirit, if any, is active in the home, and how long it has been working off the energies of those who live there, could it maybe be affecting the inhabitants of the home's desire to maintain a clean home?  Even if it's not anything evil, if someone is mentally not equipped to deal with something paranormal, do you think that it can perhaps affect them to the point where they are so worried about it that they lose interest in taking care of the home?  I know that a lot of people ARE just slobs, I see what their rooms look like when they check out of our hotel.  Some have been here for four months on a long work assignment and their rooms are immaculate after they leave, while others have been here anywhere from overnight to a week or two and their room looks like the apartment that the Collier brothers lived in.  But I would also consider the condition of the home in correlation to the type of activity they're reporting as a sign thatmaybe things are a bit more serious than might have originally been thought.  Just my 2 cents.

Elle


#7 Vlawde

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 12:12 PM

Naw. Some people are just slobs/pigs!   biggrin.gif
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#8 lorddraven2000

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 07:09 PM

Thus does seem to be a rather inconvenient problem in our field. We had a home so cluttered I just could not feel anything about the pics was paranormal because the shear amount of junk made reflections so common that one would think the room was walled in mirrors. It was a horrable experience for my team and we really could not express it for fear of alienating our client

#9 BrxGhostWriter

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 08:48 PM

I know most people dislike Paranormal State (myself included), but one of their first episodes was in a trailer that was something like what you described--clutter, clutter everywhere; the rooms had barely a path to walk in. The team sat down and discussed how they thought the clutter in the home was contributing to the bad feelings and uneasiness and how the strange sounds could be random objects falling from the piles of stuff. They actually DID sit down with the client and tell them this--gently, from what they showed on tV anyway. They told them that the atmosphere in the house would improve if there was less clutter; the family supposedly did clean out their clutter and did report feeling happier. Of course, this was also the episode where the male homeowner got possessed by Belial . . . so, take it with a grain of salt, I guess. smile.gif

I do agree that clutter screws up the energy of a home; my home is cluttery, unfortunately, and once it gets to a certain point, it drives me crazy and I have to straighten up and go through the papers, etc. Walking into a cluttered environment is suffocating; when you live there, it will mess with you. I have always felt like the clutter messes up the energy flow in the house and after awhile it messes up a person's energy. At least that's what I've felt from my experience. After reading what some of you have experienced, I feel MUCH better about my house--it isn't nearly that cluttered.

Nicole

#10 Ectoplazzum

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Posted 15 August 2008 - 09:14 PM

QUOTE(BrxGhostWriter @ Aug 15 2008, 11:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I know most people dislike Paranormal State (myself included), but one of their first episodes was in a trailer that was something like what you described--clutter, clutter everywhere; the rooms had barely a path to walk in. The team sat down and discussed how they thought the clutter in the home was contributing to the bad feelings and uneasiness and how the strange sounds could be random objects falling from the piles of stuff. They actually DID sit down with the client and tell them this--gently, from what they showed on tV anyway. They told them that the atmosphere in the house would improve if there was less clutter; the family supposedly did clean out their clutter and did report feeling happier. Of course, this was also the episode where the male homeowner got possessed by Belial . . . so, take it with a grain of salt, I guess. smile.gif

I do agree that clutter screws up the energy of a home; my home is cluttery, unfortunately, and once it gets to a certain point, it drives me crazy and I have to straighten up and go through the papers, etc. Walking into a cluttered environment is suffocating; when you live there, it will mess with you. I have always felt like the clutter messes up the energy flow in the house and after awhile it messes up a person's energy. At least that's what I've felt from my experience. After reading what some of you have experienced, I feel MUCH better about my house--it isn't nearly that cluttered.

Nicole



There is clutter, and then there is filth.  Clutter doesn't necessarily mean a home is dirty.  A home can be cluttered and still be very clean, and at the same time, an uncluttered home can be as dirty as you could ever imagine.  It just depends what the clutter is comprised of.  If it's homey things like collectibles, afghans, pillows, things like that, the clutter can give the place a homey feel.  If the clutter consists of empty snack bags, dirty laundry strewn around, and stacks and stacks of old newspapers and junk mail, then even though the place might technically not be dirty (in terms of dust and grime), the place doesn't look clean and certainly doesn't give off a homey vibe.

I have clutter in the way of afghans and pillows, kitty beds tucked into the corners, and baskets of yarn from crochet projects I'm working on, but I despise dirt and refuse to live with it.  

Elle


#11 Ms. Tify

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Posted 16 August 2008 - 04:22 AM

Wow, that would be a hard call, Amethyst.  I agree with your feelings about the clutter, but whether or not you should tell your client that is a hard decision.

People who are hoarders are emotionally unbalanced anyway.  They have a really hard time parting with stuff, it's like they use the excess clutter to protect themselves, like a cacoon.  They would be so attached to their possesions, I am sure they would rather think there is a ghost in the house, than get rid of anything.

There is probably not much you can do for them, besides what you have done.  I feel sorry for the kids involved, having to grow up in an environment like that.

Ectoplazzum, there is clutter and then there is CLUTTER.  I had an aunt who was a hoarder.  Really, you can't believe how much stuff one person can pile into a house.  She saved EVERYTHING, and kept buying more.  Anything with a flat surface was stacked with piles of stuff.  And then it gets dirty because you can't clean a house properly when there is no room to move.  Yikes!
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#12 BrxGhostWriter

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Posted 16 August 2008 - 08:01 PM

QUOTE(Ectoplazzum @ Aug 15 2008, 09:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There is clutter, and then there is filth.  Clutter doesn't necessarily mean a home is dirty.  A home can be cluttered and still be very clean, and at the same time, an uncluttered home can be as dirty as you could ever imagine.  It just depends what the clutter is comprised of.  If it's homey things like collectibles, afghans, pillows, things like that, the clutter can give the place a homey feel.  If the clutter consists of empty snack bags, dirty laundry strewn around, and stacks and stacks of old newspapers and junk mail, then even though the place might technically not be dirty (in terms of dust and grime), the place doesn't look clean and certainly doesn't give off a homey vibe.

I have clutter in the way of afghans and pillows, kitty beds tucked into the corners, and baskets of yarn from crochet projects I'm working on, but I despise dirt and refuse to live with it.  

Elle


I crochet, too! I have a whole yarn closet . . . smile.gif  Kind of embarrassing, really, but I love yarn.

Nicole



#13 lorddraven2000

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Posted 17 August 2008 - 03:25 AM

QUOTE(Ectoplazzum @ Aug 16 2008, 01:14 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
There is clutter, and then there is filth.  Clutter doesn't necessarily mean a home is dirty.  A home can be cluttered and still be very clean, and at the same time, an uncluttered home can be as dirty as you could ever imagine.  It just depends what the clutter is comprised of.  If it's homey things like collectibles, afghans, pillows, things like that, the clutter can give the place a homey feel.  If the clutter consists of empty snack bags, dirty laundry strewn around, and stacks and stacks of old newspapers and junk mail, then even though the place might technically not be dirty (in terms of dust and grime), the place doesn't look clean and certainly doesn't give off a homey vibe.

I have clutter in the way of afghans and pillows, kitty beds tucked into the corners, and baskets of yarn from crochet projects I'm working on, but I despise dirt and refuse to live with it.  

Elle



This is so true, I myslef am a clutter king, lol. I keep everything but I have it orginised in a way that keeps it from being all over the place.


#14 Winter

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Posted 19 August 2008 - 08:49 AM

Errg! My stomach got twisted up just reading about that house. Okay maybe I'm a hater of clutter, it seems I'm always having to de-clutter my house. But, I do think that it seems to clog up the space and makes people  feel uneasy at least. I hope they do clean the place out and make it less stifiling and then maybe some good, fresh energy will come in. Like you said, those kids need some room to move. I don't blame them for not wanting to sleep in there. It will be interesting to see if their problems clear up just by clearing out some stuff.

#15 ForbiddenPoet

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Posted 19 August 2008 - 11:27 AM

I would suggest doing a walk through before agreeing to do an investigation and tell the client that you cannot investigate a home where you can't even walk through it and that some cleaning would have to take place and decluttering before you COULD bring your team into the home.

Explain to the homeowner that you are not meaning to come across as sounding rude or anything, but you and your team simplay cannot get accurate measures or lead a through investigation without the rooms being decluttered before hand because it would interfere with the vibes of the rooms and could throw the investigation off.

I think this would be the best way of handling the situation and if they really want you there... they will comply. smile.gif
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#16 LGISPres

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Posted 19 August 2008 - 03:34 PM

In our team, I'm knowledgable in Feng Shui and during the reveal when we tell them we got nothing conclusive because of the filth and clutter, I also explain how the excess clutter can allow energy to collect and stagnate. This energy can then, through disuse and gathering of family emotions, begin to affect the house in a negative way. It can also be an invitation to negative entities since the excess junk in the house is usually a source of contention amongst the dwellers. So the negative entities can begin using the  energies to manifest and continue by feeding off the family's emotions.
So far, this approach has been effective. In all but one house, during follow up visits, the house has been much cleaner and less cluttered and the families have reported less tension and ghostly activity.
I feel the Feng Shui approach is good because it gives them a root cause of their haunting that THEY can correct. No amount of saging, prayers or other means is going to be effective in a house that is just keeping energy from flowing and refreshing. If there is stale energy, something can feed off it and remain active. If the family wants the ghosts gone, they'll clean up.
Plus, it lets the family know that complete strangers think their home is a sty, without actually having to come out and say it.
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#17 Caniswalensis

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Posted 25 August 2008 - 06:45 AM

QUOTE(LGISPres @ Aug 19 2008, 06:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Plus, it lets the family know that complete strangers think their home is a sty, without actually having to come out and say it.

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That is too funny!




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